Workaround for Piggyzone

[hoppy96pgtbs]

Would it be possible to have piggyzone just automatically run (on foot) toons from zone A to Zone B? For instance we could setup our own paths using a simple path record plugin or macro, or use paths provided by others? Seems like it would be a little less tedious than having to manually run 6-8 toons zone to zone to zone. Just an idea. Input?

 

[kegasu]

That sounds like a great idea! I'd love to see that!

 

[Rasmussenn]

Would it be possible to have piggyzone just automatically run (on foot) toons from zone A to Zone B? For instance we could setup our own paths using a simple path record plugin or macro, or use paths provided by others? Seems like it would be a little less tedious than having to manually run 6-8 toons zone to zone to zone. Just an idea. Input?

Navigation does that does it not?

 

[Lorekeeper]

I was brain storming about this idea but the devs are a bit busy currently I'm sure, I'd like to see a plugin we could record our own walk path however so we don't get banned for using it, it would be random locs, They cannot track that.. (EASILY).

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

Would it be possible to have piggyzone just automatically run (on foot) toons from zone A to Zone B? For instance we could setup our own paths using a simple path record plugin or macro, or use paths provided by others? Seems like it would be a little less tedious than having to manually run 6-8 toons zone to zone to zone. Just an idea. Input?

Navigation does that does it not?

I have no Idea about Navigation. Never used it or heard of it till now. I'm just coming back to the game after a couple year break. I'll look into that

 

[Villageidiot]

I was brain storming about this idea but the devs are a bit busy currently I'm sure, I'd like to see a plugin we could record our own walk path however so we don't get banned for using it, it would be random locs, They cannot track that.. (EASILY).

mq2advpath and you could record all you want

 

[SiegeTank]

Yeah a while back I was trying to use mq2AdvPath as a substitute for all forms of autofollow.The problem with autofollow, even the MQ versions, is that lag leads to following toons getting stuck behind objects and at corners. I find for some reason this is even worse with two toons in different instances on the same computer.

My idea was to move the lead toon and record his path with MQAdvPath. Then copy the path file from his MQ dir to the MQ dirs of my other toons. Then play back HIS path file on their instances. The "following" toons should run the EXACT same path as the lead toon.

Strictly speaking this isn't a "follow" since the lead toon has already gotten TO the target spot. But it works especially if the path is potentially dangerous since then you only have to deal with aggro on one toon.

I never finished this project but my goal was to program on the lead toon's computer to automatically copy his path to the MQ directories on the other toons' computers, over a network.

This was intended for movement in a single zone but I suspect the idea would be adaptable for PiggyZone purposes.

 

[dewey2461]

There are a few problems with AdvPath.

First you have to record the path from A->B. When you play back its easy to still get stuck on objects unless your careful on your route.

Second you have to be close to path when you start. So you need to have something besides just AdvPath which can say I'm currently here. How do I get to a path with out going through a building or wall, etc. MQ2Nav is close but still doesn't get it right a lot of the time.

Third even when AdvPath is working well it has problems clicking items like PoK portals. Works some times, others not so much.

I spent a fair bit of time building up a UI for advpath and adding stuff to it.

 

[JimJohnson]

The issue with MQ2AdvPath is if your have a background instance its to easy to lose a point and get stuck as said above.

You could easily do pre recorded paths for each zoneline from any zoneline. As you go through zones you call a walking path file that is already created, the problem with this is everyone is stupid and would use the exact same one that someone else made, making it easy for them to watch for.

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

the problem with this is everyone is stupid and would use the exact same one that someone else made, making it easy for them to watch for.

I agree JJ, b/c I would definitely upload my paths to have about 400 loops and doughnuts for no reason. Then there would be 50 people all running in circles in one zone lol

 

[hawthorne]

And then there would be much bitching on here.

"Why am I only running in circles?"

"Can someone upload a good path from Pillars to XYZ zone?"

"Why do I see so many people running the same path as me?"

etc. ad infinitem

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

And then there would be much bitching on here.

"Why am I only running in circles?"

"Can someone upload a good path from Pillars to XYZ zone?"

"Why do I see so many people running the same path as me?"

etc. ad infinitem

Yea, that was a joke But all joking aside, I think this is a pretty good idea.

What about this as a possible capability: The ability to load multiple paths that all start at point X and end at Point Y, but they all have different path's in order to get there, and when doing /zone it will randomly choose one of the paths that are available.

And to take it a step further, for more open or outdoor zones, add a random +/- 10 (or w/e the user would prefer) to each and every X and Y /Loc along the entire path, so regardless of what paths are used, they would never be completely identical regarding X and Y locations used for travel.

I'm not very fluent on that type of coding, but I imagine this type of code could be used, or pieces and parts of it.

/varset pathvariable 10

Math.Calc[${Me.X}+${Me.Y}]

${Math.Calc[${Target.Y}-${Math.Cos[${Target.Heading}]}]}

${Math.Distance[${Math.Calc[${Target.Y}-${Me.Y}]}]}

 

[devestator]

Could this be done? Sure.

The plugin side to handle this would not be that difficult really, it's the paths that are going to be a HUGE amount of work.

Think about a zone like PoK, you are going to have to have a path from every stone to every stone, plus the bazaar, guild lobby, herald, priest of discord, and I'm sure I'm forgetting something.

And then if you want multiple paths from each one to each one so that it can randomly choose one, you are talking hundreds of paths for this one zone.

MQ2Navigation might could be used for lifetime members to eliminate the need for paths, but then that leaves the problem of MQ2Navigation is always going to choose the same route so it would be the same as having a single path that everyone uses. And there is also the problem that MQ2Navigation simply doesn't work in some zones, and has been known to cause crashing problems.

I definitely would not even think of asking the MQ2 devs to put that much work into recording so many different paths. And I just don't forsee users contributing enough to make it worthwhile. A lot of users would keep their paths for themselves so that no one else uses them. The few who do contribute would likely get annoyed with having to record new paths every time they go to new lightly used zones.

All in all with as many zones in EQ, you'd be talking thousands (probably tens of thousands, I really don't know how many zone connections there are) of necessary paths to do every zone. Just to poke at PoK example again, there are at least 25 zone connections in PoK, that means each 25 will need 24 paths minimum to get to all the other connections. Thats 600 paths with only one path for each destination. If you said you wanted at least 3 paths for each path so that it could randomly choose one you are at 1800 paths just for PoK. Granted you could cut those numbers in half if you used the same paths in reverse, but that cuts down on the randomness of it and has characters following the same paths.

Randomizing the points on the path could be done sure, but you are increasing the risk of getting stuck, and when a bot gets stuck it's very hard to make it not obvious. Since the bot cannot see the world it has to actually get stuck before it knows it's stuck (meaning it has to stop moving forward as it expects to), and then it has no way of knowing how to safely get around the object since it can't see it's dimensions, so really the only thing it can do is back up a little and try to randomly move in another direction to get around it.

And one last thing to further compound the problem. If you are in the middle of a zone and wanted to /zone somewhere, you'd have to run to a location on one of the paths, otherwise the plugin would have no way of knowing a safe path to the pre-recorded path.

Sorry to be a joy killer, I just don't see this realistically happening. But maybe someone will prove me wrong, who knows!

 

[KingArthur]

I really enjoy Dev's logic in this thread. This is exactly the post we need in the community.

Ty Big D.

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

I totally concur with all your points, I probably should have brought up the PoK thing first, I think just flat out skipping PoK would be a good thing. And maybe concentrate on the latest couple expansions first then work our way down would be ideal. It's not that hard to hoof it through PoK. I'm mainly talking about the long hauls, North Valley of Lunanyn to Sarith for example.

Initially to make /zoning from any zone in EQ to any other random zone would be quite the task. So to only concentrate on VoA for a week, then HoT, etc etc would be ideal. I do not envision this happening over night, and I would be willing to sacrifice an hour or two here and there to help this cause, as I'm sure a few others would be.

With proper direction (I have no clue how to even get this started) I think I could get the ball rolling for others. Maybe if we had a new plugin (in the lifetime Beta section) called /zoneonfoot or something similar to dedicate to this and see how well it fairs.

Randomizing the path by as much as +/- 2 or 3 would even work, and would further prevent getting stuck. My only reasoning behind this, is so that no one would ever run the exact same path on the exact same /loc's.

 

[dewey2461]

Randomizing the path by as much as +/- 2 or 3 would even work, and would further prevent getting stuck. My only reasoning behind this, is so that no one would ever run the exact same path on the exact same /loc's.

Randomizing loc is more likely to get you stuck.

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

Randomizing the path by as much as +/- 2 or 3 would even work, and would further prevent getting stuck. My only reasoning behind this, is so that no one would ever run the exact same path on the exact same /loc's.

Randomizing loc is more likely to get you stuck.

Is this the only post in this thread you have read?

 

[Sum1]

Randomizing the path by as much as +/- 2 or 3 would even work, and would further prevent getting stuck. My only reasoning behind this, is so that no one would ever run the exact same path on the exact same /loc's.

Randomizing loc is more likely to get you stuck.

Is this the only post in this thread you have read?

haha. Win.

But seriously, I know PoK is a beast, and there are a few other zones I can think of that would be ridiculous (anything with huge z-axis changes and lots of zone connections), but I think with some patience it could be done.

Maybe make the basic plugin that reads from a character-created .ini using specific, predefined paths recorded on your first run through a particular area. Not everyone will ever have a reason to go back to some of the really old school zones, so they would never need a unique zone connection for those zones. What you could do is have the plugin recognize when they've zoned into a particular zone for the first time (and have it notify you with a popup or text or something), and then you could be asked to select from the zone connections available in that particular zone (like a list of all zones that branch off from there). You select what connection you're about to record to, and then off you go! The plugin records your movements this one time, adds it your .ini, and any further zones into this zone going to this connection can be handled automatically rather than manually.

I don't know how difficult it'd be to flesh out something like this, but it would let anyone record their own specific zone paths to the places they actually care about. You could even trick it, maybe... like say for example you zone into lavastorm. You get asked if you want to do a connection to Sol A, but you never ever ever go there, nor want to... but you DO always go to the faction camps. You can select Sol A, record a run to the faction camp, and then end the record there, so next time you can just /zone Sol A and, despite the fact that it's not intuitive to anyone else, your toons willl run to your faction camp (which is where you want them) instead of the zone you never ever go to. This trick would only work for zones where there's no connections through the spoofed zone location.

Anyway, just some thoughts flooding out of me. Maybe helpful, probably not.

 

[hoppy96pgtbs]

Randomizing the path by as much as +/- 2 or 3 would even work, and would further prevent getting stuck. My only reasoning behind this, is so that no one would ever run the exact same path on the exact same /loc's.

Randomizing loc is more likely to get you stuck.

Is this the only post in this thread you have read?

haha. Win.

But seriously, I know PoK is a beast, and there are a few other zones I can think of that would be ridiculous (anything with huge z-axis changes and lots of zone connections), but I think with some patience it could be done.

Maybe make the basic plugin that reads from a character-created .ini using specific, predefined paths recorded on your first run through a particular area. Not everyone will ever have a reason to go back to some of the really old school zones, so they would never need a unique zone connection for those zones. What you could do is have the plugin recognize when they've zoned into a particular zone for the first time (and have it notify you with a popup or text or something), and then you could be asked to select from the zone connections available in that particular zone (like a list of all zones that branch off from there). You select what connection you're about to record to, and then off you go! The plugin records your movements this one time, adds it your .ini, and any further zones into this zone going to this connection can be handled automatically rather than manually.

I don't know how difficult it'd be to flesh out something like this, but it would let anyone record their own specific zone paths to the places they actually care about. You could even trick it, maybe... like say for example you zone into lavastorm. You get asked if you want to do a connection to Sol A, but you never ever ever go there, nor want to... but you DO always go to the faction camps. You can select Sol A, record a run to the faction camp, and then end the record there, so next time you can just /zone Sol A and, despite the fact that it's not intuitive to anyone else, your toons willl run to your faction camp (which is where you want them) instead of the zone you never ever go to. This trick would only work for zones where there's no connections through the spoofed zone location.

Anyway, just some thoughts flooding out of me. Maybe helpful, probably not.

I like it, thanks for the great input on this. Would be something where people would not have the same paths, or be uploading files so others could use. Just make it an option for people to use at their own discretion, and would be great for people that box and have to move a lot of toons around with no Wizzy.

Good suggestions!

 

[Sum1]

And I think the fact that we already have all the zone connections/paths defined in the piggyzone plugin would make the generation of a path running plugin like described above a little easier. You have most of the tedious-to-get information already available, so it'd be a matter of writing the plugin to use it.